needing tips for outdoor portrait phtography [Archive]

bongmanayon

10-21-2007, 07:07 PM

Yeah...sounds like about everything...:Grin:

Okay, for starters...

The myth of being out in the sun. Snapshooters are known to pull their subjects out in bright sunlight which is really a no-no because a) they are squinting and look irritated in the heat and b) they either look like they have eyebags or need a shave (may bigote...including the women) because of the way the shadows fall on their features.

So avoid direct sunlight by putting your subjects in a shade and do your best to make sure that any indirect light comes from the side.

More later...

Bea Belen

10-21-2007, 07:08 PM

I'm also quite interested in this. I usually shoot my outdoor portraits in daylight, so there are no real problems for me there. The REAL issue is at night, when lighting, camera settings and the use of a flashgun are usually hit-or-miss for me.

oh yeah.... i usually shoot portraits in late afternoon.. i like it when theres little natural yellow light... oh well thanks michael

Jeff Vergara

10-21-2007, 07:11 PM

a reflector will definitely help in your shoot. :)

Bea Belen

10-21-2007, 07:13 PM

Bea Belen

10-21-2007, 07:14 PM

a reflector will definitely help in your shoot. :)

yup... trying to raise the money for equipments hehhe salamat

bongmanayon

10-21-2007, 07:26 PM

Awareness of the environment can lead to a great outdoor portrait with just a camera...

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2084/1670799670_1b397a0deb.jpg
MZ-M + SMCP (K) 135/2.5 + Kodak Supra 400

She is standing with her back to direct sunlight (so it gives the highlights in her hair) and in front of a concrete lanai which serves as the reflector illuminating her face which would be technically be in a deep shadow.

Bea Belen

10-21-2007, 07:30 PM

bongmanayon

10-21-2007, 07:42 PM

yup... trying to raise the money for equipments hehhe salamat

Offhand, the only equipment you might actually need is a prime portrait lens which a big aperture (I have a SMCP K 135/2.5 & a SMCP A 135/2.8). An FA 77/1.8 or a DA 70/2.4 is something to wish for. Which camera are you using na ba? I lost track...

jeffreyebiteng

10-21-2007, 07:44 PM

help guys more tips hehhe got some from paeng

"paeng salamat talaga"

help help need tipssss

How about bringing/using reflectors, it helps in minimizing shadows. Cheers.

Jeffrey

Bea Belen

10-21-2007, 08:18 PM

Offhand, the only equipment you might actually need is a prime portrait lens which a big aperture (I have a SMCP K 135/2.5 & a SMCP A 135/2.8). An FA 77/1.8 or a DA 70/2.4 is something to wish for. Which camera are you using na ba? I lost track...

k100d and probably use my zenith 58/f2-f16 lens....

thing is... i attached the lens and walang nag aapear na light meter so what i do is that i take a shot, check and then adjust.... but it works and i like the outcome... actually it was paeng who reminded me that i can use my old lens... thanks po

Jeff Vergara

10-21-2007, 08:30 PM

i agree with bong with the awareness of the surroundings. it can be used as background to add life to portraits. also, whether indoors or outdoors, catchlights are preferred. here's a sample. hth. :)

"the prayer"
http://www.jeffvergara.com/dpp/030907_jbp11.jpg
f5.6, 1/250sec, 14mm, iso200

jose_deluna

10-21-2007, 08:34 PM

As others have suggested... use reflectors (lots of reflectors), as it would definitely help you achieve excellent outdoor portraits utilizing available light. Honestly, it's all about light... pay more attention on the quality and direction of light. Ikaw mismo ang mag-ko-kontrol kung saan mo pababagsakin ang liwanag at dilim (light and shadow).

Here are some of my own samples of controlled lighting in outdoor portraiture...

http://www.pbase.com/josedeluna/image/86424983/medium.jpg

http://www.pbase.com/josedeluna/image/86424982/medium.jpg

http://www.pbase.com/josedeluna/image/86424961/medium.jpg

http://www.pbase.com/josedeluna/image/86427520/medium.jpg

Bea Belen

10-21-2007, 08:40 PM

Bea Belen

10-21-2007, 08:43 PM

josephnoelreyes

10-21-2007, 10:28 PM

bea,

you can also use fill flash to minimize or lighten the shadows when shooting under direct sunlight, in the shade or even inside with natural light coming from the side.

1. outdoor, under direct sunlight
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2188/1673062396_a16d1fa91c.jpg

2. outdoor, shade
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2412/1673211616_a9221e8468.jpg

3. indoor, light from window on side
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2273/1673160684_e1867eef08.jpg

bongmanayon

10-22-2007, 12:44 AM

k100d and probably use my zenith 58/f2-f16 lens....

thing is... i attached the lens and walang nag aapear na light meter so what i do is that i take a shot, check and then adjust.... but it works and i like the outcome... actually it was paeng who reminded me that i can use my old lens... thanks po

Hmmm...is your Zenith a K-mount or a screw-mount? The f2 is perfect for knocking off the DOF; if it works it means that the custom setting is properly set to shoot without the "A" function. You should be able to meter using the DOF preview in the shutter release or by using the AE-L button to automatically get the right shutter speed.

Both photos; the one prior and this one uses a manual metering lens (without the "A" function). Light from the side and using the natural reflection from a concrete wall as fill-in.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2153/1674134733_0c1d10694f.jpg
DS + SMCP (K) 135/2.5

bongmanayon

10-22-2007, 12:46 AM

I'm also quite interested in this. I usually shoot my outdoor portraits in daylight, so there are no real problems for me there. The REAL issue is at night, when lighting, camera settings and the use of a flashgun are usually hit-or-miss for me.

Sorry Mike...we almost missed you :Grin: What flash do you use?

noliperfecto

10-22-2007, 05:07 AM

Like Bong said - take note of the background. Choose a background that would provide a good contrast or compliment your subject (and his or her attire).
Nols

Franz A.D. Morales

10-22-2007, 08:15 AM

Michael_Arcilla

10-22-2007, 09:25 AM

Sorry Mike...we almost missed you :Grin: What flash do you use?

Right now I'm using a Sunpak 383 Super Auto Thyristor. It's always a messy affair to try to use the any of the three auto modes, so I always use manual mode. But when I match the settings on the flash and the camera (i.e., same ISO and aperture settings, I still find myself constantly having to adjust some setting to compensate for over/underexposure.

By that time, my subject is bored with me. :(

bongmanayon

10-22-2007, 09:39 AM

By that time, my subject is bored with me. :(

Hehehe...:Grin:

I use the Vivitar 285HV which is more or less in the same class as your Sunpak. And it did require a lot of fiddling around when I first combined them. I wonder, what shutter speed do you operate on? These old flashes assume a flash sync of either 1/60 or 1/125 (my DS would not trigger a manual flash when set higher than 1/125 or lower than 1/45...I think). You are shooting on manual mode right?

Btw, because of the way the sensors on these thyristors work, be conscious of what is in your foreground. Any intervening object will reflect the light back prematurely and shut down your flash leaving you with an underexposed shot.

Michael_Arcilla

10-22-2007, 10:10 AM

Hehehe...:Grin:

I use the Vivitar 285HV which is more or less in the same class as your Sunpak. And it did require a lot of fiddling around when I first combined them. I wonder, what shutter speed do you operate on? These old flashes assume a flash sync of either 1/60 or 1/125 (my DS would not trigger a manual flash when set higher than 1/125 or lower than 1/45...I think). You are shooting on manual mode right?

Btw, because of the way the sensors on these thyristors work, be conscious of what is in your foreground. Any intervening object will reflect the light back prematurely and shut down your flash leaving you with an underexposed shot.

My maximum flash sync speed is 1/180 (though it sometimes fails to trigger) but I usually shoot a lot slower to compensate for the low (or no) light. So that's usually around 20-80. And yeah, I shoot in manual mode about 90% of the time. I only recently got around to learning Aperture priority (which I'm beginning to love) and TAv (which is still shaky ground for me.) Sv is something I can't get the hang of, especially since I really don't like it when it overrides my preferences and shoots in ASA 1600 (NOISE! Argh!)

Do you ever shoot with the flash in auto mode? I got irritated with the inconsistency early on and decided to shoot only in Manual mode with it.

What do you mean by "an intervening object in the foreground"? Am I right to assume that shooting a multi-level composition (items in foreground, deliberately out of the DOF range) will throw the thyristor off? So using it in auto means... I can only shoot with nothing between the lens and the main subject?

Randall Cipriano

10-22-2007, 10:14 AM

My maximum flash sync speed is 1/180 (though it sometimes fails to trigger) but I usually shoot a lot slower to compensate for the low (or no) light. So that's usually around 20-80. And yeah, I shoot in manual mode about 90% of the time. I only recently got around to learning Aperture priority (which I'm beginning to love) and TAv (which is still shaky ground for me.) Sv is something I can't get the hang of, especially since I really don't like it when it overrides my preferences and shoots in ASA 1600 (NOISE! Argh!)

Do you ever shoot with the flash in auto mode? I got irritated with the inconsistency early on and decided to shoot only in Manual mode with it.

What do you mean by "an intervening object in the foreground"? Am I right to assume that shooting a multi-level composition (items in foreground, deliberately out of the DOF range) will throw the thyristor off? So using it in auto means... I can only shoot with nothing between the lens and the main subject?

If you have a flash capable of high-speed sync / fp mode you can go higher than the flash sync speed (up to 1/4000 for the K10D and 540/360). But as a consequence, it lessens the flash range considerably.

Michael_Arcilla

10-22-2007, 10:23 AM

If you have a flash capable of high-speed sync / fp mode you can go higher than the flash sync speed (up to 1/4000 for the K10D and 540/360). But as a consequence, it lessens the flash range considerably.

I'm actually torn between saving up for the 540FGZ... or the DA18-250 (or the DA50-200/DA*50-135). Choices, choices.

Michael_Arcilla

10-22-2007, 10:30 AM

I'm no portrait photographer, but I am a student of the discipline, and what I've learned so far, Bong has enumerated quite nicely...

@Michael: This is what I do... for portraits at night, I almost always use a flash except when the subject agrees to not move for the duration of the long exposure in available light... I use my flash off cam in manual mode, depending on the available light, I set my flash from 1/2 - 1/8 power (I rarely set the flash in full power), my camera settings are set at 1/125 f/8 or f/11... after firing a test shot, I adjust accordingly on the camera(after setting the flash, I rarely adjust the flash's settings)... if it's overexposed, I stop down my aperture two stops... if the test shot was underexposed, I open up the aperture two stops... then from there, another test shot, then fine tune accordingly... either I slow the shutter or set the aperture to let in more light or lessen it... I'm no master and I'm still in the process of learning... at first it will take time, but its fun (and addicting...)! and in no time, you'll be calculating in your head what settings to use in a given situation in a (pardon the pun) flash!... or you can use your flash in P-TTL mode...:D

Do you mark those settings regardless of the lighting conditions, as a general rule, in other words? Or do you meter first with the camera? Basically, that's what I do. In general, though, I either choose a shutter speed or an aperture and then adjust either the other setting or the flash power to compensate for over/underexposure.

One thing that throws all this talk off, however: BOUNCE FLASH. Simple enough in the day and in well-lit indoors, at night it's a mess! I get a lot of fallout at the edges and corners... or the subject's top half is overexposed while the bottom half is underexposed. Sigh. :D Once again, it takes a couple of tries to get the settings right. I do, however, carry a small pocket notebook around to record my settings (since the EXIF data won't show the flash settings.)

Randall Cipriano

10-22-2007, 10:57 AM

I'm actually torn between saving up for the 540FGZ... or the DA18-250 (or the DA50-200/DA*50-135). Choices, choices.

If those were my choices I'd get the DA*. But I currently have no use for that focal range so I'll wait for the 60-250/4.

Bea Belen

10-22-2007, 11:06 AM

Bea Belen

10-22-2007, 11:11 AM

Hmmm...is your Zenith a K-mount or a screw-mount? The f2 is perfect for knocking off the DOF; if it works it means that the custom setting is properly set to shoot without the "A" function. You should be able to meter using the DOF preview in the shutter release or by using the AE-L button to automatically get the right shutter speed.

Both photos; the one prior and this one uses a manual metering lens (without the "A" function). Light from the side and using the natural reflection from a concrete wall as fill-in.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2153/1674134733_0c1d10694f.jpg
DS + SMCP (K) 135/2.5

its a k-mount i guess coz i dont need an adpter... thats the lens i used before with my k1000 when i still use film... ive actually miss my zenith lens hehe thanks

Bea Belen

10-22-2007, 11:13 AM

Like Bong said - take note of the background. Choose a background that would provide a good contrast or compliment your subject (and his or her attire).
Nols

oh okay... all of them i think are hs students

Bea Belen

10-22-2007, 11:17 AM

Randall Cipriano

10-22-2007, 11:22 AM

Xander Angeles is one of the country's well known fashion and advertising photographers. :)

Franz A.D. Morales

10-22-2007, 01:06 PM

Do you mark those settings regardless of the lighting conditions, as a general rule, in other words? Or do you meter first with the camera? Basically, that's what I do. In general, though, I either choose a shutter speed or an aperture and then adjust either the other setting or the flash power to compensate for over/underexposure.

One thing that throws all this talk off, however: BOUNCE FLASH. Simple enough in the day and in well-lit indoors, at night it's a mess! I get a lot of fallout at the edges and corners... or the subject's top half is overexposed while the bottom half is underexposed. Sigh. :D Once again, it takes a couple of tries to get the settings right. I do, however, carry a small pocket notebook around to record my settings (since the EXIF data won't show the flash settings.)

I have my own notebook as well to record my settings for given situations... but as a general rule, if it's semi-dark I use 1/4 power or less, and when it's dark, I use 1/2 power(very rarely full for me...) I adjust exposure on the camera...

In total darkness, I usually use flash to capture my subject then use a longer shutter speed to capture the ambient light...

Bea Belen

10-22-2007, 08:58 PM

Xander Angeles is one of the country's well known fashion and advertising photographers. :)

yeah indeed he is really good

Michael_Arcilla

10-22-2007, 10:06 PM

I have my own notebook as well to record my settings for given situations... but as a general rule, if it's semi-dark I use 1/4 power or less, and when it's dark, I use 1/2 power(very rarely full for me...) I adjust exposure on the camera...

In total darkness, I usually use flash to capture my subject then use a longer shutter speed to capture the ambient light...

Slow-sync flash, then? It's hard to do hand-held, though.

victor_vesuna

10-22-2007, 10:20 PM

You may find this site useful
Photographing People: Controlling the Light for Better Portraits

http://www.betterphoto.com/article.asp?id=175

Franz A.D. Morales

10-23-2007, 07:01 AM

Slow-sync flash, then? It's hard to do hand-held, though.

Hard if the shutter is longer than the second mark hehe... I can manage up to .7" though... that is if it's only the ambient light I'm capturing and not the sharpness of the background, as long as the subject is sharp, I'm all good:)

Michael_Arcilla

10-23-2007, 08:41 AM

Me too. Though I can sometimes manage as long as 1.3" or even 2", if I hold my breath and stretch my arms out (using the strap on my neck as an anchor point.) But there's always the tiniest bit of jitter. :-s

Franz A.D. Morales

10-23-2007, 08:57 AM

Unless you're Bong! A human tripod with nerves of steel! hehehe...

bongmanayon

10-23-2007, 09:18 AM

Unless you're Bong! A human tripod with nerves of steel! hehehe...

Nerves of steel? These days it feels like rigor mortis ... :D:Grin::D:Grin:

Franz A.D. Morales

10-23-2007, 09:30 AM

Nerves of steel? These days it feels like rigor mortis ... :D:Grin::D:Grin:

Hahaha... I'm sure rigor mortis won't be setting in for a significant number of years:)

Michael_Arcilla

10-23-2007, 09:42 AM

Rigor mortis?? Hahaha!!!

Do cramps count?

josephnoelreyes

10-23-2007, 11:39 AM

totie.bruno

10-23-2007, 11:43 AM

so are you finally giving us tutorials one of these days Ptr. joey? :D

there are long weekends that coming... hehehehe...

josephnoelreyes

10-23-2007, 12:01 PM

totie, bro, will check with my wife re our long weekend sked. it's their sem break din, just want to be sure she doesn't have any plans yet.

totie.bruno

10-23-2007, 12:36 PM

i'm not in a hurry naman Ptr. Joey... and besides, i guess some will also liked the idea of having a tutorial EB with you... :)

Michael_Arcilla

10-23-2007, 12:46 PM

@michael: BOUNCE FLASH

there are some things to consider when bouncing:

the distance of the flash to where you want to bounce the light - ceiling, wall
the color of the ceiling or wall
the kind of flash you use - does it tilt and swivel, tilt only, or is it fixed
the output level of the flash (full, 1/2, 1/4...)
the availability of other reflective surfaces aside from walls and ceilings (i also bounce my flash off of the crew's white polo shirt)
the use of a lightsphere or any other diffuser/reflector/bounce card

let's practice nga soon. bounce flash and white balance settings

joey

Exactly. Sometimes I forget these things and keep bouncing my flash on the closest surface, regardless of distance or color of the surface (which sometimes results in lovely warm tones and casts (yellow or orange walls - but mostly sucks.)

I'd like to get a lightsphere, but I don't want to invest in one for my Sunpak since I plan to upgrade to the AF540FGZ or the 530DG Super in the near future and might find the sizes are radically different.

bongmanayon

10-23-2007, 01:52 PM

Exactly. Sometimes I forget these things and keep bouncing my flash on the closest surface, regardless of distance or color of the surface (which sometimes results in lovely warm tones and casts (yellow or orange walls - but mostly sucks.)

What helps me in bouncing my flash were all those times I sneaked out of my classes in college to play billards. :D

Seriously, that is actually a good exercise in the law of physics to help determine the path and angle of the light relative to the camera and the subject. These days though, I have a diffuser permanently on my Vivitar 285HV.

Michael_Arcilla

10-23-2007, 01:58 PM

It's strange you mention that, because I used to play billiards an awful lot too, and rather prided myself on my understanding of physics and geometry. I never thought to apply it to photography, though. But what you said was just the epiphany I needed! :D

josephnoelreyes

10-23-2007, 08:50 PM

i spent six years in college, four of which were in the billiard halls of s.h. loyola street.

billiard eb anyone?

jeffreyebiteng

10-23-2007, 09:13 PM

Bea try also using fill in flash..... Cheers.

Jeffrey

bongmanayon

10-24-2007, 12:53 AM

Franz A.D. Morales

10-24-2007, 07:42 AM

i spent six years in college, four of which were in the billiard halls of s.h. loyola street.

billiard eb anyone?

Hahaha game! I too spent six years in college, four years in Billiard halls! haha... lost my tuition fee once in a cash game, but managed to salvage half of it the next day! ahaha... billiards EB!!!:Grin:

josephnoelreyes

10-24-2007, 12:40 PM

Hahaha game! I too spent six years in college, four years in Billiard halls! haha... lost my tuition fee once in a cash game, but managed to salvage half of it the next day! ahaha... billiards EB!!!:Grin:

AWWWRRRIIGGHHHTTTT! pentax billiards eb.

can we dedicate the first game to paeng?

Michael_Arcilla

10-24-2007, 12:55 PM

Billiards na! :D Where's a good place to play these days? One of the many Efren "Bata" Reyes franchises? AMF Puyat?

Michael_Arcilla

10-24-2007, 12:56 PM

By the way, it was good to meet you yesterday, Joey. Thanks for all the advice and help. :)

Franz A.D. Morales

10-24-2007, 12:57 PM

@joey: We can wager who gets to keep Paeng:D hahaha... I hear Ansbert is quite the "tirador." hehehe... game! Billiards EB!

Michael_Arcilla

10-24-2007, 01:04 PM

Paeng Bonafe

10-24-2007, 01:11 PM

@joey: We can wager who gets to keep Paeng:D hahaha... I hear Ansbert is quite the "tirador." hehehe... game! Billiards EB!

@joey, franz: i can probably beat you blindfolded using my lefthand :D

Franz A.D. Morales

10-24-2007, 01:32 PM

@joey, franz: i can probably beat you blindfolded using my lefthand :D

Look Joey! Someone is challenging us! :D Let's feed him to the sharks shall we? hahaha:D

Paeng Bonafe

10-24-2007, 01:42 PM

Look Joey! Someone is challenging us! :D Let's feed him to the sharks shall we? hahaha:D

sharks?!?! i feast on them sharks!! :D:Grin::D

josephnoelreyes

10-24-2007, 04:23 PM

@joey: We can wager who gets to keep Paeng:D hahaha... I hear Ansbert is quite the "tirador." hehehe... game! Billiards EB!

idol, though i never gamble, i believe that if you'll put up your bellows as a bet i can sure make an exception.

josephnoelreyes

10-24-2007, 04:25 PM

@joey, franz: i can probably beat you blindfolded using my lefthand :D

i don't back out of challenges. and because there is one now, i believe LBA can wait - i have to buy me a cue stick. uwi ka na paeng!!

SET! SET!

Jay2Cenon_Tarun

10-24-2007, 04:40 PM

Wow!.. Pentax Billiards Challenge 2007.. hahahaah..
Wanna join.. join.. join.. Let's see who's the best.. :Grin:

Bea Belen

10-24-2007, 05:28 PM

oh wow... billirads EB coooooolll!!!!

josephnoelreyes

10-24-2007, 06:09 PM

let's call it THE FIRST PAENG CUP PENTAX 9-BALL CHALLENGE or something

bongmanayon

10-24-2007, 07:11 PM

OT na...

Very strange though. I haven't changed lenses since the replacement and cleaning of my focusing screen and sensor... but when I woke this morning to snap a few shots - black specks all over! :( A bulb blower isn't helping. :-/

EDIT: Just found four specks of dust on the sensor. Sigh.

This got buried, what's the latest Mike?

PS Sama ko sa billiards...:Grin:

Jay2Cenon_Tarun

10-24-2007, 11:15 PM

So when will it be.. the THE FIRST PAENG CUP PENTAX 9-BALL CHALLENGE.. saka saan... hahahahah.. There's a long vacation ahead of us.. PAENGTAXIAN!!!!:Grin:

cyronmaano

10-24-2007, 11:55 PM

Hello,,nubie here again,,wow,,can i join also? =)......

Chelo Pascua

10-25-2007, 04:37 AM

Very strange though. I haven't changed lenses since the replacement and cleaning of my focusing screen and sensor... but when I woke this morning to snap a few shots - black specks all over! :( A bulb blower isn't helping. :-/

EDIT: Just found four specks of dust on the sensor. Sigh.

Was just wondering if the shutter curtain is shedding those "dust" particles...it has been an issue with the Sigma SD10 dSLR.

Franz A.D. Morales

10-25-2007, 06:58 AM

idol, though i never gamble, i believe that if you'll put up your bellows as a bet i can sure make an exception.

Hahaha and you putting up your K10D on the block as well? :D

I have had numerous dust problems even after "blowing" out the camera, but my problem was that the back of the lens was dirty...:Dum:

josephnoelreyes

10-25-2007, 07:02 AM

Hahaha and you putting up your K10D on the block as well? :D

I have had numerous dust problems even after "blowing" out the camera, but my problem was that the back of the lens was dirty...:Dum:

see mike? always make sure your lenses are clean. especially the ones we buy used.

Michael_Arcilla

10-25-2007, 08:47 AM

OT na...

This got buried, what's the latest Mike?

PS Sama ko sa billiards...:Grin:

Still haven't resolved it. Blower after blower, even with my newly-cleaned lenses, I can't seem to shake those specks off the focusing screen. I haven't tried the sensor yet (still paranoid over my last incident.)

I might have to head back to Sanly's Cubao to get it cleaned again.

But since I haven't changed lenses at all since then (I still have the SMCP-M 50/1.4 on it) I wonder where the specks could be coming from. Perhaps it's from some of the particles falling off the fibers surrounding the focusing screen (i.e. what happened to Randall - or was it Franz?) and they just keep falling in. I dunno. But it's getting me very very very OC about it. It's keeping me from shooting like mad. :(