How much time do you spend doing post processing work after a shoot? I know it depends on the number of pics that you took and maybe how good the base picture is but approximately how many minutes per each pic?

How much time do you spend doing post processing work after a shoot? I know it depends on the number of pics that you took and maybe how good the base picture is but approximately how many minutes per each pic?

1K raw files takes me 1 whole day, exposure and color adjustments(thanks to
Synchronize). Retouching and intense editing takes me 4-7 days depending on the number of pics to be use in the album... It's so hard to approximate the minutes on each picture..

wow thats a very long time to sit in front of the PC.

You have to spend long hours with your PC if you really want to have a very good output.

for 1k-1.3k of photos, it takes me about 4-5hrs. i shoot raw, so the adjustments(including color shifts) are a bit easy compared to doing it in PS. also, i dont "salvage" a really bad shot. :D makes my life easier. . .

different story naman here, we shoot in jpeg and we try to get the colors right during the shoot itself so that post processing won't be needed anymore. we do the adjusting on-cam. of course yung mga "sayang" ginagawan pa ng paraan. :)

John, how do you get the color right when the subjects are moving, like the entourage for example? Exposure is hard enough righ? What more the right colors?

Let's get our notebook and pen ready... :D

different story naman here, we shoot in jpeg and we try to get the colors right during the shoot itself so that post processing won't be needed anymore. we do the adjusting on-cam. of course yung mga "sayang" ginagawan pa ng paraan. :)

yup, yan ang discipline na ni instill sa atin ni master jong. :D im proud to be imagination hahaha. we dont need to post process our work ;)

John, how do you get the color right when the subjects are moving, like the entourage for example? Exposure is hard enough righ? What more the right colors?

Let's get our notebook and pen ready... :D

naku hindi ako marunong mag turo! haha basically ganito lang : test shots, adjust kelvin, tests shots, adjust kelvin, test shots, adjust kelvin.. haha! basically you test shots first before and adjust the kelvin before the actual walk (for example sa march na ah) para set ka na. once you're set, pitik pitik na lang yan! sounds easy noh? haha.. (sabi ko sayo hindi ako magaling mag turo eh!)

it really pays a lot to know how to use kelvin to get the right colors. :)

yup, yan ang discipline na ni instill sa atin ni master jong. :D im proud to be imagination hahaha. we dont need to post process our work ;)

amen! same here.. kahit ano i-shoot ko may it be weddings or photojournalism it helped A LOT. :)

Hi Christopher,

When I was starting, I used to resize, crop and adjust the color tones, contrast etc. in the computer but when the load for the work started coming in, I have no choice but to shoot like I was using a film-based SLR and that is to do everything already using the camera as what Ems and John said, it saves us a lot of time and improve our craft as a photographer instead of a photoshop artist.

Nowadays, there is a trend especially for overseas based clients who only require the CD Proof after the wedding so having a laptop as what Rolly said is now an essential tool in every event coverage which can also be used for the Photo Slideshow of the shots taken at the hotel for the pre-wedding rituals. This started in the Advertising industry wherein the CD proof is given to the Art or Creative Director after the shoot and that's it, you go home with your professional fee and their creative team or graphic artist does the post-production work for them. It's more of Real Time or On-Demand turnover of your images 15 to 30 minutes after the shoot depending on the number of photos you have taken.

As much as possible avoid deleting photos while you are shooting. Believe it or not, what we consider as bad is sometimes what the client likes. It's better to have more choices instead of saving on our CF Cards, try shooting in JPEG-Fine (Medium). Let them be the judge of our work since we are being paid as professionals. They are also the ones who will choose the 120 to 150 images for the lay-out design to be used for the wedding album.

There are no right and wrong comments. Each of us have our own unique experience to share. Choose the ones that is most applicable to you in every wedding coverage you have. Until then. Best Regards.

naku hindi ako marunong mag turo! haha basically ganito lang : test shots, adjust kelvin, tests shots, adjust kelvin, test shots, adjust kelvin.. haha! basically you test shots first before and adjust the kelvin before the actual walk (for example sa march na ah) para set ka na. once you're set, pitik pitik na lang yan! sounds easy noh? haha.. (sabi ko sayo hindi ako magaling mag turo eh!)

it really pays a lot to know how to use kelvin to get the right colors. :)

question po.. paano kapag fuji s3 ang gamit, at walang kelvin wb...
custom white balance ang gagamitin? saan po itututok? (follow the test-adjust procedure?)

how do i know kung ok na yung color/settings, salamat po

anong magandang gawin kapag naka sb-80dx tapos 18-55 3.5-5.6 lens kung kukunin yung march from secondfloor, last time i tried, ang dilim even at wide open and iso800.. :D

question po.. paano kapag fuji s3 ang gamit, at walang kelvin wb...
custom white balance ang gagamitin? saan po itututok? (follow the test-adjust procedure?)

how do i know kung ok na yung color/settings, salamat po

anong magandang gawin kapag naka sb-80dx tapos 18-55 3.5-5.6 lens kung kukunin yung march from secondfloor, last time i tried, ang dilim even at wide open and iso800.. :D

wow s3, what a nice camera.. love the colors of that cam.. :)

i'm not really familiar with that camera but back then when i was using a 350D i just used the presets (cloudy, daylight, shade, etc) to get the colors i wanted. i'm not really sure ah, but i've heard that the awb of s3 is pretty good. maybe another person could answer this? hehe sorry bro!:)

thanks for the comments. and sir eric i agree as you get more weddings scheduled youll defnitely need to cut down on processing time to maximize your work.

Yes John, you make it sound easy. :D

You also make it seems like the light will not be changing for the duration of the wedding.

yup, yan ang discipline na ni instill sa atin ni master jong. :D im proud to be imagination hahaha. we dont need to post process our work ;)

intresting workflow, i'm intrested in learning your workflow :) . You adjust WB from the cam right? I've done this once, but i find it too slow(for me). I'm a raw shooter, i find raw much accurate and better.. Have you tried whilbal? if you're a jpeg shooter or a raw shooter this one is the best, tried it in jpeg/raw and the results are fantastic.

Yes John, you make it sound easy. :D

You also make it seems like the light will not be changing for the duration of the wedding.

hehe kaya nga you have to adjust and adjust and adjust.. it will just come naturally once you get used to it :)

how do you adjust by kelvin? is it applicable to the d70? i can only see preset logos and "pre", so how is it done by numbers? thanks!

Hi Christopher,

You have several tips for you to follow that have been shared with you but ultimately, you will find one that will be perfect for your needs. Personally, I dont shoot the whole wedding in RAW. If I know for a fact that the lighting is tricky, I don't want to spend too much time switching from 1 white balance to the other, especially if I will shoot alternating with fill flash and available light. A great moment could easilly slip.
When ever I take a photo, I like to take it as perfect as I can. I don't rely on RAW to "fix" the corrections because RAW can only do so much as well. So, I do take test shots when necessary and try to take a mental note of the different light qualities if they are consistent that way I don't chimp too much on the lcd. So to anser your questiion on how long it takes me to "clean up" my files, it takes me around 2 to 3 hours of cleaning and extracting using Adobe Bridge

ms. Pilar. thanks for the input. So you never do heavy PP on your favorite photos anymore?

i guess you can only be like that when youve grown to be a very good photog that can nail the shot in 1 or 2 actuations.

seriously though i wasnt expecting you to say you dont shoot everything in RAW. Another testament to your skills maam. Only those who are very confident about their skill can do that i think hehe.

Dom,

Try shooting from the 2nd Floor with a Prime Lens or adjusting the shutter speed to 1/125 sec. or 1/80 sec. It really helps to be early at the Church and Reception Venue to do your test shots. What is the position of your SB-80DX Speedlight? Is it 90 or 45 degrees? The position of the flash also affects your lighting as well as adding diffusers like the Omni-Bounce. Experience is the best teacher.

Regarding Getting the Right Color, there is a book at Fully Booked in Rockwell entitled "Getting Color Right" by Michael Walker and Neil Brastow - ISBN-1-904705-24-3 worth
Php 1,999.00 that you might want to consider buying. Sometimes there are display books that you can read before you make a purchase. Good Luck and Best Regards.

If I'm not mistaken... quite a lot of wedding photographers shoot in JPEG and not in RAW. Their philosophy being, get it right the first time, all the time.

ms. Pilar. thanks for the input. So you never do heavy PP on your favorite photos anymore?

I do photoshop the images that will make it to the album. I also don't like the photos to look like it's been heavily photoshoped.

i guess you can only be like that when youve grown to be a very good photog that can nail the shot in 1 or 2 actuations.

Experience does help in "nailing" the exact exposure but taking test shots and understanding your histogram is mandatory with digital and most especially when shooting in jpg


seriously though i wasnt expecting you to say you dont shoot everything in RAW. Another testament to your skills maam. Only those who are very confident about their skill can do that i think hehe.

I would be insane to shoot a wedding with my 5D purely in RAW. 1 gig only gives me 50 shots. I do however shoot the 20D mostly in RAW. (I bring 12 gig with me just to make sure I have enought ammo:Grin: )

See?

Miss Pilar spoken, the file format is not commensurate to her skills. It is merely a choice in the question of storage capacity.

If you can nail it with JPG, with RAW, you still have a lot of room to tweak it for more enhancement... like if you already have a perfect WB in JPG, you can decide to change it to a different WB settings for creativity reasons only if it is RAW.

Besides, ALL camera shoots RAW. Even the P&S ones. :P

See?

Miss Pilar spoken, the file format is not commensurate to her skills. It is merely a choice in the question of storage capacity.

If you can nail it with JPG, with RAW, you still have a lot of room to tweak it for more enhancement... like if you already have a perfect WB in JPG, you can decide to change it to a different WB settings for creativity reasons only if it is RAW.

Besides, ALL camera shoots RAW. Even the P&S ones. :P Good point! Exactly what I had in mind with my first few wedding VAs. I shoot RAW, also thinkin Im a VA only, so im not pressured to make those perfect shots, and later I can manipulate those for my portfolio. This happened, not only once. I was shooting RAW, being focus to the event, I had my SD filled up, and quickly I changed SD. the worst part was I missed something which I should have captured, and I miss a lot on several occassions.


Another was some of the weddings had this Slideshow during the reception, from there I notice, JPGs are better off in a situations like 15-30mins after shoot and show the shots done earlier.



As for cameras with no Kelvin, I have a hard time testing whats best for the lighting.

sir don. you can always shoot RAW + sJPG if you need the pics for a slideshow right there and then. :)

but of course that doesnt take care of the space problem and the missed opportunities when changing CF cards.

i guess you can always load an 8 gigger hehehe.

when i have a slide show, i use both the jpg and raw when necessary and have no problems with it. I use Iview. what do you guys use for slide show presentations?

I use ProView for slideshow. :D

I use ProView for slideshow. :D

Is that for mac and pc? can RAW be used for it as well?

Thanks

Sorry Miss Pilar, it doesnt work with RAW. I do not know if it has a version for Mac either.

Shame, it's seldom I am asked a question by you and I can't give a possitive response. :(

How much time do you spend doing post processing work after a shoot? I know it depends on the number of pics that you took and maybe how good the base picture is but approximately how many minutes per each pic?
First of all I shoot jpeg on weddings. Only the group shots infront of the altar are shot with RAW. Post processing time depends on the photos landing on the album. If the couple has 250 photos in their album it would take me more time to Post process the photos. I recommend the couple to just limit their photos to 100-150 photos. Post processing are mainly done globally meaning levels, curves, color balance, etc. unless there are items to be erased in the photos (believe me there will be) I once shot a wedding on Medium Normal jpeg. I just see to it that the photos I took will not be severely cropped. The album is just 12 x 12 even a 3Mpixel shot at Large Fine jpeg will be enough just as long as not being severely crop. So, there is no exact measure as to how long to post process your wedding photos. Maybe I can process it in 2 days maybe you can do it in half the time.

This is what I usually do to save time on PP. Plan the album layout prior to the wedding. Shoot the wedding with photo ideas on your mind that will land on your album. This is to avoid shooting like a videographer. Learn the discipline of shooting right the first time on weddings (I learned this from Lito Sy during his workshop) 'coz there might not be another 2nd chance. I'd rather have a blurry image with great concept than a sharp image with no story at all. The clients are not really particular with white balance as long as they look normal, heck most them don't even know what white balance is.

I agree with John and Ems. Use Kelvin if you have it. Use preset white balance if you need it. Adjust on-cam. I shoot at P and S mode most of the time. It makes me capture the moments right, rather than twiddling with your settings and then all you know you have nothing to shoot already. Know your camera well to make things easier.......


HTH :)

what are the usual camera settings used by wedding photogs when using available light and with the aid of a flash?
manual, shutter / aperture priority, auto, etc...

thanks!

what are the usual camera settings used by wedding photogs when using available light and with the aid of a flash?
manual, shutter / aperture priority, auto, etc...

thanks!

No fix rule there. It depends. I've had various mix and simple tungsten, some halogen lighting, some fluroescent, some mix of all kinds of light.

What I do is I carry a white bond paper and fold it and put it in my pocket. With the 20d, if the light is tricky, I shoot the white paper where the light falls (or the bride's dress or the mantle or whatever is white) with AWB set in the camera. Then I go to menu and do a CWB. Then I set the camera to CWB - voila, a properly balanced setting! No fiddling with kelvins or anything else. It takes about 10 sec to do this. Maybe less.

I only go raw when the scene is important or critical but the lght mix changes (e.g. videographers light go in and out of the scene, or couple or bride is moving in a mixed/complex lighting situation).

I also go to raw in group shots or formals. You'll never know if you are going to do large blow-ups so best get that 10-bit data intact. Makes it easy to color correct too in case you bungled the AWB. But I make sure I have RAW+jpg so that if the jpg is ok, I don't have to do raw conversions.

But my raw files never go above 70-80 in a wedding. That's out of 800-1,200 shots. And I usually process only the ones I will need for the blow-up or if the color correction is tricky.


Not that I am lazy, but raw files are big. Also, you are going to bring the pics to the lab, they would like to work with jpgs and not TIFFs anyway, so unless you need a good reason, shoot RAW when you only need to. RAW also limits your shoot because on a 20d you only get 6 shots of raw and then you have to wait a bit for the buffer to clear. It's about 10 with the 30d. If you use jpg, you have 23-28 shots always on beck and call and flusing the buffer is easier.

Since I do it right the fist time, the bonus are the following:

1. If I were not on parameter 2, I won't even have to process! I just cull and select. But it takes me only 2-5 hours to do basic processing (sharpening, cropping, mild color correction, saturation adj, local dodge & burn, etc) for 800-1,200 pics. This also includes backing up the stuff to DVDs and a 2ndary HD.

2. I can print right there and there. And even if I have to process, it will take me 2-5 hours tops to select the top 400 and do some sharpening due to my less agressive settings on-cam. Of course, if there is a digital layout involved, we are talking 2 days or more here. But to get the basic pics ready, is around 2-4 hours avg for me on a 800-1,200 shot event.

3. For several events, it's nice to know you got your color, exposure right and you are ready to go asap. you can then do slideshows mtv/avp in just 1 hour or less, etc. You can charge extra for this.

4. You sleep early and ready to collect the balance of your payment sooner! :-)

5. You are ready for your next project earlier. No backlogs or minimal backlogs. Less headaches and irrate clients.

6. Clears the HD and CF cards early for the next project. Less clutter, and preps you for next job, etc.


Moral of the story? -- Do it right the first time.

Check and make sure your Color balance, composition, exposure are right on before you click the camera. It will save you hours, even days in PP work!

based on my experience yap it depends on the number of pictures ..the more errors the long photo editing would be..i sometimes do editing on the camera itself by deleting bad shoots.. i knew it was risky..that you may delete it all..but sometimes it helps a lot to lessen pc work.. you should conduct this deligently.richie pingol was once my mentor told us that one common mistake of a photographer is to rely dependently on photo editing software..we should have this attitude na dapat sa shoot mo palang ay you are at the right settings na.beside we all have the setting to make our subject standout.

I shoot JPEG and I feature my photos in slideshows using Picasa immediately after the shoot. So I agree with getting it right in camera as much as possible to save time and effort. Not only is it more efficient, but it also gives a good impression to your clients and their guests, which leads to more projects. :)

After the shoot though, I do walk the extra mile and spend a long time working with Photoshop, at least an entire day for a whole day's wedding shoot. I often look at my images and see something I didn't see when I first took the photo, or there's another image within an image if you crop it. Maybe the image looks better if you play with the saturation and color, and the list just goes on. It's your time to make good pictures even better, so making the effort to squeeze some more punch out of your images using Photoshop isn't necessarily a bad thing.

Angelo,

I agree with you that there is nothing wrong working with Photoshop or doing the extra mile is not necessarily a bad thing. In my case, post-production editing is now limited to the 120 to 150 images chosen by the couple from the CD Proof and to be used for the final lay-out design of the album.

During the last Photo Congress, it was emphasized that we should both be good in shooting and in using the latest technology available but as a photographer, I believe we should spend more time shooting instead of editing. My post-production work-flow like you and Mam Pilar does not take more than three (3) days as I have to meet deadlines by demanding clients as well. Best Regards.

Angelo,

I agree with you that there is nothing wrong working with Photoshop or doing the extra mile is not necessarily a bad thing. In my case, post-production editing is now limited to the 120 to 150 images chosen by the couple from the CD Proof and to be used for the final lay-out design of the album.

During the last Photo Congress, it was emphasized that we should both be good in shooting and in using the latest technology available but as a photographer, I believe we should spend more time shooting instead of editing. My post-production work-flow like you and Mam Pilar does not take more than three (3) days as I have to meet deadlines by demanding clients as well. Best Regards.

All good points. I guess this is a perspective I don't see a lot of yet, since I'm still shooting weddings part-time. Not being able to tinker with images as much is probably an adjustment I'll need to make at some point.

In your case, do you have your clients choose the photos first before you post-process them? What I do is that I put together the album layout first, then show that plus the proofs to the client. They usually just pick one or two photos to replace after that. How long does it take for them to get back at you for the selections? Do you impose a timeline for them to decide so that they don't forget or keep putting it off?

Hi Angelo,

Let me answer your questions:

1. In your case, do you have your clients choose the photos first before you post-process them? What I do is that I put together the album layout first, then show that plus the proofs to the client. They usually just pick one or two photos to replace after that.

Answer - In my case, I let the clients choose first the lay-out design after they make a 50% downpayment. I have five (5) designs to choose from depending on the type and size of album they want. I've learned my lesson not to show my work and designs to anyone through the internet. It has to be done personally even for clients based abroad. If the client is leaving for their honeymoon the next day, the CD Proof is turned over within 1 hour after the wedding reception.


2. How long does it take for them to get back at you for the selections? Do you impose a timeline for them to decide so that they don't forget or keep putting it off?

I normally give them a week to choose the 120 to 150 images. Then 3 to 5 days is given for the post-production editing before submitting it to the Lay-Out Artist. If the client is based locally and takes a lot more time to choose, I explain to them that the timeline needs to be adjusted. Another week is given for the Creative Team for the Initial Lay-Out Design. After this, another week is given to the client to approve it. Once approved two (2) weeks is given for the printing of the images and book binding of the album. So that's a total of Five (5) weeks on a regular season. During Peak Season, it sometimes takes longer due to the volume of work. Setting a timeline is important because it helps us organize things and show the client that we provide after-sales service and mean business. Backlogs are also counter-productive because the cost of materials and other variables increase every year.

Hi Eric, Thanks a lot for your insights and comments.
If you don't mind sharing it here, what troubles in particular did you encounter sharing your stuff with clients through the web? I've been using the web quite a bit to speed up the workflow between myself and clients.