Hi DPP Members,

Here is the first installation of something that we have been planning for a while but have not yet executed until now. Welcome to our new PHOTO FACE-OFF.

This is how it works. I am posting two photographs with one distinct theme. You, the reader, will judge which image you like better and make a vote in our poll. We are not telling you which photographer took what photo so there will be no bias here. We also encourage you to comment in a post, what you like or don't like about the image. The PHOTO FACE-OFF will be fun but its main purpose is to be educational. We all hope to learn from the comments posted by our readers because we will be hearing different opinions and perspectives.

At the end of the voting, we will announce which photographer took what photo. The two photos will be featured in an upcoming DPP magazine issue along with the best comments posted on the thread.

I'll emphasize now that pointless bashing won't be tolerated.

So here we go. Have fun everyone and looking forward to hearing your takes on our new PHOTO FACE-OFF.

PHOTO FACE-OFF #1
THEME: PASILIP SA RILES- A Black and White Photo Dokyu"
Photographers: Larry Monserate-Piojo vs. Joel H. Garcia
Voting Deadline: March 3, 2009

PHOTO #1
http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z63/DPP_Gallery/02.jpg

PHOTO #2
http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z63/DPP_Gallery/01.jpg

I vote for the first one - I love the feel of desparity in the photo, you're really drawn toward the old lady who's sitting on what appears to be a sink, wearin kitten heels and a skirt, I also love the way that both she and the passenger in the first row of the car are both looking out to what seems to be an endless journey. The photojournalistic feel is what appealed to me and I love it.

The second photo just doesn't do it for me, the balut vendor looks like he was haphazzardly included in the photo, but a good photo nonetheless.

@ Nick - I didn't even notice the title at first, just went on to type before I read it again.

My vote is still the same, but with a different perspective this time. :)

Ken,

I just realized that your vote may have been skewed with our title of "Daily Commute - PNR"

When the two photographers were sent out the original theme was called

"PASILIP SA RILES- A Black and White Photo Dokyu"

I am going to change the theme to this and ask you to look at the photos once again.

Voted for first photo. First has more emotions, it speaks for itself.

Ken,

I just realized that your vote may have been skewed with our title of "Daily Commute - PNR"

When the two photographers were sent out the original theme was called

"PASILIP SA RILES- A Black and White Photo Dokyu"

I am going to change the theme to this and ask you to look at the photos once again.

done and done..

i voted for the first photo because of the composition; framing and the illusion of having two photos at one.

Id go for the first one.

It actually tells a story and lets you think of the story it tells. Though the old lady's actions of her not wanting be taken a photo is another topic to be taken into consideration.

both photos were taken well, but i go for the 1st photo. it has more to look at, more to think about and more to tell the viewer than the 2nd photo. :)

For me when I look at a Photo I like one that draws me into the story. Im drawn into the picture by the man pointing down and the arrow pointing up. The story while not as obvious as the 1st is a little mysterious and has me guessing.

The 1st photo while a great shot, the fact the the old woman is trying to avoid being shot by the photog kills the shot for me.

Voted for the first one because of the depth of the image. The tunneling aisle vs the cramped solo subject is a strong composition IMO.

I like the first photo because it expresses more stories. Looking through the door, extending to the seeming infinite path, makes you imagine what those passengers might be reflecting about. Commutes such as this makes people reflect about certain things, life, work, etc. The first photo for me expresses a stronger connection.

first photo for it's depth :D

i actually voted for the second one because of the irony that the photo represents. an emergency brake valve without anyone actually ready for the emergency. it also begs the question, would the emergency break valve even work? as for the BW conversion, i actually love both!

I voted for the first photo because the story hits me. It somewhat conveys of a woman who is cast out from society and her feeling helpless about it so she just cowered in the corner and just looking out pondering on her future..

I vote for number 2 because it carried the Theme "Pasilip sa Tren" and it show how old or rusty our train as well as it show that most of the passengers are the common people like the vendor who find his place to relax and sleep...I think the Photographer tried his best not to disturb him,so the silip of his shot makes it perfect for the theme.

Cheers,

Efraim

Excellent tone for both images.

Kudos to both artists as they were able to preserve the details of the photos.

I've picked image 1 for the sheer depth of it.

this is exciting! i keep refreshing my page just to see the answers and the poll updates.

i voted for the first photo because of clarity of subject matter, the second photo doesn't present the main subject clearly compared to the first one (is it the emergency brake or the man?).

The vanishing point of the first photo leads your eyes and gives it more depth of field

I voted number 1 for better:

1. Visual Key
2. Visual Direction
3. It reminds me of my Flickr photo (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mmncrpz/2496747536/in/set-72157605085110585/) entitled Kapit at Sulyap - Ang nakaririmarim na pagsilip sa antas ng buhay (kuha) mula sa loob ng tren ng PNR.

/m

I chose number 1.

To me it shows the age old filipino "Kasabihan" of "Matutong mamaluktot kapag maiksi ang kumot."

The old woman showed ingenuity and a resourceful soul.

I voted for the first photo because it raises so many questions from me. For example, was the old woman in despair of her situation in the train? Why was she separating herself from the others by squatting on what looks like a sink? Was there different types of accommodation in that train and she can't afford to pay for a seat that she opted for that place?...

1st one.
It gives more questions to the mind.

.. is that a drinking fountain she's sitting at?

The 2nd image had the grit, spontaneity, impulsiveness elements of a dokyu. It provoked me to study the image more, and got me thinking why (either) the calibre of Joel or Larry would submit this seemingly unconcerted frame.

The effective play of light and shadows worked here; the relationship of sleeping with darkness, dreams, and of uncertainty; the sleeping man in deep sleep, probably tired from the daily grind -- as suggestive of the 'basket/wooden pole' in front.

Then, the slashing contrast brought by the white Emergency Brake Valve panel. Suggestive of a wake-up call, a reality check -- back to the real, sad and maddening world we all are in.. as temporary passengers on a journey.

First photo: Depth, Detail, Darkness

Both are well executed but I have to choose #1

Documentaries are stories for me and the first image was able to convey it better. The 2nd image made my eyes do a double-take to decide which element was more important (emergency brake valve vs. person on seat).

Composition wise the 1st one also makes use of a lot of tried and tested composition techniques so my eyes started on the foreground immediately and it lead me to the back of the coach. Amazing depth, great emphasis on the foreground subject. It's a winner in my book.

i like photo # 1. half of it tells about solitude (the lone woman at the right) while the other half can be festive or chaotic (left side with lots of people), which can be attributed to our daily lives...

first one for me..

i simply like the emotion coming out of the old woman in the first shot.

still, both of them are winners in my book! :)

"So long as we have failed to eliminate any of the causes of human despair, we do not have the right to try to eliminate those means by which man tries to cleanse himself of despair."
Artaud, Antonin

I vote for #1 - very moving image, and telling of today's desolate living conditions of the Manila poor.

Photo #1 - Untrained eye or not, the image immediately hits you.

Voted for the 1st photo. For me, the depth of the 1st photo shows the difference in lives, both past and present.. Makes you think how the people and the railroad life was back then.. and now.. :)

very nice thread.
voted already:)

I voted for the first photo for it tells more story about the ride, the people who ride these trains and the brief idea of the physical condition of our trains here in the Philippines.

made a decision in less than 5 secs. I voted for photo #1.

reasons:
- impactful
- emotive
- tells a whole story in a glance
- basta!!!!

i voted for the first photo earlier today without saying why.

first of all, the first photo is technically more balanced. it tells a lot of stories in which i won't dwell and explain to everyone as we can interpret a lot from the scene. it allows your eyes to transition from one corner of the frame to the other without getting lost. it allows you to deduce a lot of possible scenarios and maybe talk about the ironies of life and churva churva. for all i care, maybe the old woman just didn't want to be bothered by the other passengers so she just sat there on the edge LOL.

but seriously, the second photo tries too hard to cram a lot of elements in the frame. i feel that it wants to impose a "story" on your mind rathar than giving the opportunity to the watcher to come up with his/her own interpretation. the concept on the photographer's mind might have been stellar but the execution was poorly done in my honest opinion.

cheers!

I picked the FIRST PHOTO because of how it was shot. Simply because it "DOCUMENTED" something.. no need to elaborate on that.


The second photo, yes it is ok.. but it doesn't make my eyes wander like the first one.. if it was on a magazine.. i would just have looked at it and said.. "ah.. ok. just another photo...".. moving on.. furthermore, it lacked the magnitude.. in simple terms: "the UMPH!" :)

usually, juxtaposition in a photograph dwells in either the similarity or dissimilarity of elements within that photograph. photo no.1 triumphs in both. it tells the viewer that within that wretched class of train transportation in the philippines, there still could be 2 classes- WORSE AND WORST.

IMHO, photographer no. 2 could more effectively tell a story by not skewing the framing and including elements in their entirety- forcefully telling the story of.."leaving the sleeping balut vendor to man the emergency brakes!"

i vote for no. 1

I voted for the 2nd photo because of its unusual yet creative composition that makes you think and question more not only the person who took the photo but the photo itself and the reality it represents.

I voted for the 1st photo, it represented the photos title.. it told the story :)

Both photos are really good.

Photo #1 - Easier to comprehend. The gesture of the lady saying no, her choice of seat and awkward position suggest the reason of her isolation. I'm thinking she's....

Photo #2 - I don't think the man is a balut vendor. I can see a wooden staff or pole that we usually see with magtataho and magpuputo. There's also a rope or something tied on the handle of the basket. I don't even know if they are his. One counterweight is missing in the frame, if ever there was one. Baka nakakalat lang. Looks to me like there are "obstacles" to reach the emergency brake switch. And the grungy sign, you'll wonder if it would actually work in case of, well, emergency. My interpretation is "rakenrol" sa tren na ito.

My vote goes to #2.

I like number two..how the different lines, from diagonal to upright, reinforced the message the man on the seat and the emergency sign conveys..

i'm at work and can't elaborate much further ( :Grin: ) , but i really like #1..

voted for #1 too..

For me, The photo conveys the message immediately without telling it all at once. At the first impact you'll know what the story is; but as you go deeper, you'll see the different stories intertwined that might be formed into a bigger tale of how and why people were there and why the old woman was there in isolation looking away.

With this one photo, a film can be made or a novel can be written.

Especially with photojournalism, the longer you stare at a photo or as you conjure more images beyond the frame, that's what makes it effective.

Photo #1 portrays a clear division of classes in the separation of the old woman and the passengers on the right. The dimmer half renders an impecunious state epitomizing despair while the other people are oblivious to the plight of the old woman. This for me is photojournalistic art. For what is the essence of art, if it doesn't imitate life.

I vote for Photo #1. Technically a beautiful Black and White image, having pure Blacks and pure Whites and all the different shades of Grey. Depth of Field was effectively defined using the whole length of the train as a reference to distance and scale. Since there is no reference to the horizon, the slight tilt in the composition made it look a little bit more interesting. To top it all the capture of the old lady's posture, in fetal position gives the image a sense of mystery and emotions which leads one to wonder what the story behind her departure really is.

Photo 1 gets my vote. The photographer had a story to tell. This shot was taken with that one purpose. All the elements in the photo complement the story. The lighting is dark on the woman but well lit on the cabin. Everyone is sitting comfortably whle the woman had to improsive a seat. The division between the classes cleverly divided by the door.

Voted #1, it's has a story to tell already, but the #2 photo has a potential if the photographer include the Hand Break itself, and not tilted,,,well it's jut my own opinion..

#1 for me... i like how it conveys isolation of an old lady against the other passengers... isolation that only the old lady knows...

i like the first photo-excellent depth, good composition, makes one look at it and imagine the stories behind the characters there.

Torn between the aesthetics of #1 and the story in #2.

I would've chosen #1 if the old lady on the right was doing something interesting. This would then create a visual tension between her and the passengers seated on the left side of the frame.

My vote goes to #2 but not by a wide margin. I find the white space around the emergency sign to be a bit distracting such that it diminishes to a certain extent the presence of the man at the left. Of course, I'm not sure that this would've been the best angle to heighten the perspective a bit but that's all conjecture as I wasn't there :)

voted for #1 - has a more depth, and has a lot more story to tell.

Voted 1st photo. It's simple but conveys depth. I like the contrast, not of the color, but in the composition where there is separation.
The 2nd pic doesn't trigger any reaction from my brain. There is confusion and the message is vague.

judging the photos, I already knew who among them who took the 1st and who took the second. both photos are good. but I like the first photo better. I am somehow drawn to the image. I can feel the sorrow of the old lady.

kudos to larry and joel for captureing good photographs!

Photo #1: It's because it clearly portraits that you are inside a train and visually shows the passengers and also one of the main subject (the woman on the right).

http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z63/DPP_Gallery/02.jpg

Why I don't vote for Photo#1?
- it's too "busy/cluttered" for a Pasilip view (if silip; one may expect to see at least few perspective), I mean this photo, one still has to decide where to look at.
- not normal for a silip view to see lot of stuff

*I keep on coming back to the theme.

http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z63/DPP_Gallery/01.jpg
Why I vote for Photo#2:
- it's really silip, the fact that it's tilted frame, the viewer can feel he is "siliping"...hehehe
- the balot man is almost out of the frame, it goes to show this one is only a "silip" view.

I initially chose the first photo, but upon seeing a different point at the second photo, I voted for it. I smiled at its simple yet clear depiction of the rampant colonial mentality in the country. What kind/s of people are riding the PNR? They are not the corporate slaves in Makati who speaks conyo English, nor the sosi college teens in universities who talks about fashion and the hippest gadgets in the market. They are but the underprivileged, the poor and the proletarians, who does not know (sometimes and/or most of the times) how to read and/or speak English. Look at the photo, do you think the sleeping man (a balut vendor maybe) understands the “EMERGENCY BRAKE VALVE” instruction? I don’t think so. PNR operators must have supplied a Tagalog translation of that caution so that it will help the passengers comprehend the warning.

I voted for the second photo. Brilliant photo documentary, I’ve seen a lot. Kudos to the photographer! :):):)

photo 1. the old lady is crunched up in the corner as compared to the comfortably seated passengers. furthermore, the old lady is not seated in a passenger seat - it looks like a sink she's sitting on. her being a senior citizen makes this more dramatic. at her age, one would think she would get more decent treatment or at least a proper sitting place. this image is a study in contrasts - young and old, black & white, fair and unfair, empathy and apathy. congratulations to the photographer of this image. this is more than a picture, its a lesson.

i voted for photo #1. i love how the photo was composed... the old lady who seems to be crying(?) is isolated from the rest of the passengers who are oblivious of her state... and yet it was captured in a way that we, the viewer will be able to see the whole story...

1st Photo. The photo shows you what's life inside a passenger train. a well planned shot.
2nd Photo. The photo let you experience what's life inside a passenger train-tight space. an impromptu shot.

I voted the 2nd photo.

Voted for photo 1. Much more emotion that goes well with B+W.

my vote goes to photo #1

i guess the photographer knows he has a winner capturing a good juxtaposition (an old woman sitting differently compared to the other relatively young passengers position). and it's a good 'silip' too.

Newbie comment: I like the first photo. It has a subject and shows a good depth of field. Also shows the drama of having the subject kinda outcast and alone or separated. The second photo confuses me. I don't know if the subject is the man or the Emergency sign. Well I guess it's the man because if it's the sign then the photographer could have shown the lever.

newbie comment lang po. I prefer photo#1. It has more drama and story to it and has 2 clearly defined subjects. My eyes are drawn first to the people in the background and then I catch a glimpse of manang in my periphery.

1st photo for me too. it's more dramatic, full of stories to tell and a winner eye catcher. and i kinda know who made that shot. :)

Photo #1 is passive.

Photo #2 is active.

Let me explain: When I judge photo competitions, I confine my subjectivity to the THEME of the contest. The THEME defines the rules or parameters upon which path a judge will take his subjectivity to task.

Specifically, the theme here is "PASILIP" - i.e. "to peek"

Based on that criterion alone, Photo #2 responds to the THEME with bull's-eye accuracy. Photo #1 has nothing much to hide because most elements inside the train are exposed. The viewer's eye just feast from one corner of the photograph to the other corner and his curiosity is answered and satisfied. Photo #2 stirs a lot of curiosity because the viewer's interest in finding out what goes behind the wall (with the 'emergency' signage) remains hanging. If you will notice, that white wall occupies nearly 70% of the photo's real estate, concealing a lot of the things you wanted to see inside the train. It teases the viewer with a glimpse of a passenger (balut vendor) on the front seat. The tendency is to look for more, to want for more. That itch of looking for more puts one into action - that is why I said Photo #2 is active.


Since the THEME is documentary in approach ("A Black & White Photo Dokyu" - as mentioned) the elements of sharpness, depth, resolution, etc. becomes trivialized. In fact, composition becomes secondary. In photojournalism, the capture is supreme.

Well said, Sam! Can I ask you to judge some of our Citi Camera Club photo contests? :)

Well said, Sam! Can I ask you to judge some of our Citi Camera Club photo contests? :)

Sure! It's going to be an honor, Wins.:)

Back to topic, I see that voting had been closed long before (months ago). Had I seen this thread and made my comment earlier, I could have tilted the results? - in favor of photo #2? hehehe:)

i can't see any drama on the second photo, so i must go to the photo#1!